EU Referendum

REMAIN or LEAVE
BLEIBEN oder AUSTRETEN

Remain-1425_klein

Do you know what kippers are?
Maybe not only what you think, what our dear Master and Siri and Selma like for breakfast. They are the members of UKIP, the UK Independent Party. Unfortunatly we are surrounded by people who still dream of the British Empire – that will be a rough awakening.

Wisst Ihr was “kippers” sind?
Nee, falsch geraten! Das sind nicht nur die warmen geräucherten Heringe, die Masterchen und wir Buchfeen zum Frühstück lieben, sondern die Anhänger der UKIP-Party, die immer noch vom Britischen Empire träumen. Huch, das wird ein fürchterliches Aufwachen geben.

Erna Sollberg, the Primeminister of Norway, said to the British people: “In case you are wandering what it will to be like outside the EU, you will hate it. You will have to deal with daily adversities.”
She knows.

Erna Sollberg, genannt die dicke Erna, Premierministerin von Norwegen, sagte den Engländern mit wissendem Gruß, “Wenn Ihr Euch wundert, wie es sein wird, außerhalb der EU zu sein, kann ich Euch versichern, dass Ihr es hassen werdet. Wir Norweger haben tagtäglich mit den dadurch entstandenen Widrigkeiten zu tun.”
Sie muss es ja wissen.

Remain-1412_klein

Our late friend Martin Evans, the last eccentric of Cley, said:
“It’s better to be inside the tent pissing out, than being outside the tent pissing in.”

Unser verstorbener Freund Martin Evans, der letzte Exzentriker Cleys, meinte:
“Es ist besser, vom schützenden Zelt nach außen zu pissen, als von außen ins Zelt.”

Shall we say more?
Sorry, we have to go out erecting our “Vote Remain” poster.

Gibt’s da noch mehr zu sagen?
Entschuldigt uns, wir müssen nun unser “Vote Remain”-Plakat draußen aufstellen.

Vote

We Bookfayries beg you for voting REMAIN and our dear Dina and Master as well
Wir Buchfeen bitten Euch “Remain” zu wählen und unsere liebe Dina und Masterchen auch
Please, let’s stay together
Bitte lasst uns zusammenbleiben
The Fab Four of Cley

 

© Text and illustrations, Hanne Siebers and Klausbernd Vollmar, Fredrikstad and Cley next the Sea, 2016

271 thoughts

  1. We are going to have to agree to disagree this time, my Fab Four.
    I am not remotely racist. I am also not a Nationalist. I would never vote for UKIP, and I think that they are nonsensical.
    However, I come from a strong Trade Union, Left-Wing past. I was a former Communist, and expelled from the atrocious New Labour Party, for being a member of Militant Tendency. I welcome immigrants, and refugees too, in the spirit of this country that has welcomed the persecuted since the 12th Century.
    But the EU is a failed experiment. A bureaucratic nightmare that has no relationship to modern life. We don’t use the Euro, we disagree with most of their laws, and the money we receive props up some areas, but ignores others. It is Euro-Capitalism by other means, the home of multi-national conglomerates, and shady deals. On Thursday, I will be voting for principles above comfort, or profit. Although I do not expect to win.
    I will be voting to leave, and hoping that the protest wakes up some sleeping Eurocrats.
    Love from Beetley, Pete and Ollie. X

    Liked by 4 people

    • “But the EU is a failed experiment”, agree with you – EU isn’t part of the solution but part of the problem – I am very much european minded, but don’t see why we have to have this bungled administration and patronage – like the norwegian model to stand outside – I’m definitely not nationalistic and not see strangers as enemies at all, but it should be done better than what the EU deliver – and cheaper …🙂

      Liked by 3 people

    • Dear Pete,
      thanks a lot for your comment.
      Like all the German intellectuals I have been communist as well. I have been in the SDS, the group starting the German student revolution. And I agree with you staying in the EU is a vote for European capitalism, there is no doubt about it. But for my understanding leaving the EU rises the question who has to pay the bill. For my understanding it will be the workers and those who are not so well off who have to pay the bill. The EU is a certain garanty to to have at least basic social rights. I suppose leaving means to transform the UK into a country like the US, a country in which only those who are successful will win. What M. Thatcher started will come with leaving to its aim, no more social rights.
      Of course in the UK everything will be getting more expensive as the UK doesn’t own many producing industries any longer. And a country like the UK cannot compete with such a group of counties which are the strongest economic power in the world. There will be big cuts in expenses for culture and all social affairs. With staying one votes for the smaller evil I would say. You can see it already that big international companies are leaving the UK, the pound is going down and all this means more unemployment.
      For me the EU is far from being ideal but the UK outside the EU is much worse.
      Well, that’s my understanding of a debate which is – as I think – much too emotional and full of wrong information. Such an important vote should be reflected and not lead by the feelings.
      With lots of love from Cley to Beetley
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 6 people

    • Dear Drakenoir,
      as I just wrote to Pete, I don’t think that the EU is ideal, but the UK which is only build on banking nowadays is worse without it.
      Thanks for commenting
      Klausbernd, Siri and Selma

      Like

    • Thanks for the reply, KB. You know all too well that I not only respect your intelligence, and your opinions, I also agree with many of your thoughts and contentions. However, whatever the outcome, I could no more vote to stay in this mess, than vote for a Conservative to be my M.P.
      Love and best wishes. Pete and Ollie. X

      Liked by 1 person

    • By voting to leave you are in effect voting for the most ideologically extreme form of Tory government, untrammelled by liberal EU rules. People like Gove are fans of Ayn Rand and her extreme economic libertarianism – “creative destruction” – which could make the Hunger Games look like a picnic. This ought to be total anathema to any Socialist, unless you’re hoping it will lead to the inevitable proletarian revolution. It won’t. It’ll just lead to a lot of suffering for a lot of people – and unbounded joy for the rich and powerful.

      You cite the US not wanting to be dictated to by Canada and Mexico. Well, they aren’t – thanks to NAFTA the US dictates to Canada and Mexico. Outside the EU the US, or its corporations, will dictate to us through the ISDR kangaroo courts. It may even do so within the EU if the idiots sign TTIP. As a Socialist I will vote to Remain as by far the lesser of the two evils. I find the Leave campaign unutterably vile and the leaders likewise. I could cheerfully strangle the lot of them, but I could never ever vote for them.

      Liked by 6 people

    • Good morning, dear Richard,
      thank you very much for commenting on our blog🙂 We know about your political insights and we are very happy that you shared them with us.
      We 100% agree with you.
      Have a happy day
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

    • Hi Pete,
      I agree with you, totally, that very much is wrong with the present EU. No doubt there at all. But, given my life’s history [born just after WWII into a divided Germany], I’ve always been and will always be a strong defender of European unity. Only in a union we will overcome nationalism and national extremism, which is rising its ugly head in many European states again. The British vote will only strengthen these tendencies – within GB and within Europe, I’m afraid. Going it alone has never made anyone stronger. I really fear that the British vote will, in the end, have made both Britain and the EU weaker. I fervently hope and at the same time seriously doubt that our politicians will be able to learn and act positively.
      Good luck to us all, within or without the EU,
      Pit

      Like

    • Naturally, I respect both your opinion, and your life experience, Pit. I have never supported the idea of international capitalism, of which the EU is a prime example. I have also never felt European, nor even really British, so have not hankered for the unity you describe.
      If those on the Far Right prosper from this decision, then we will have to take them on, as we have done before.
      Best wishes, Pete.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Thanks, Pete, for your answer, based on different different experiences/beliefs than mine. But based on ration, not emotion – and that’s what we sorely need in these times. Let’s simply work for a good outcome, each of us on his side.
      Best wishes,
      Pit

      Like

    • Sorry, Pete. I’m really not into the details, so I probably spoke out of turn. Has there been ample discussion on alleviating that ? (Frankly – I don’t like Mexico telling anyone how to do anything, they can’t get their own sh*t together!!

      Liked by 2 people

    • No need to apologise, GP. It’s a very emotive issue here, that probably doesn’t concern anyone in North America. The discussion consists of exaggerations and downright lies, by both sides. You just have to put your vote where your heart lies, and hope for the best.
      Best wishes as always, Pete.

      Liked by 2 people

  2. I cannot help but think that while being a member of EU may not be perfect, being outside of it would produce so many financial and political difficulties. The days of the strength associated with the “British Empire” have long gone, and survival in the current world will be dependent on unity. Thinking that life will improve outside of EU is no different from believing that the grass is greener on the other side of the fence. This is not a time for an emotional or romantic decision. It is suggested that all the aspects of being a member of EU are considered, and then some thought put into how it would survive commercially and financially if the EU countries “closed the door” on the UK. I would respectfully suggest that the UK needs EU much more than the EU needs the UK! Any thoughts to the contrary is little more than romantic twaddle!

    Liked by 4 people

    • You can retire on a pension in Greece and Portugal at 55. Can we do that here? Another example of where EU practices are ignored by our government. What’s the point of being in something that our government can veto? We fail to get the best of it, so might as well go back to being on our own. We currently have a balance of trade deficit on our behalf, so might as well use that. Most goods are sourced from China and the Far East anyway, so is the EU the powerhouse it still claims to be? I cannot agree that we need the EU more than it needs us, or any individual country, for that matter.
      Regards, Pete.

      Liked by 2 people

    • Hi Pete. I certainly respect your views, but to bring Greece into the argument as a country to compare with? They may appear good on the surface but, as far as I am aware, they have been close to bankruptcy a number of times – are now loaded with “bale-out” debts – and are now defaulting on those payments. You cannot retire in Canada (nor I suspect the US) at 55 unless you had prior investments in a retirement plan. Is it just possible that, for whatever reason, the expectations outside of EU are perhaps unreasonable? Just some thoughts.

      Liked by 3 people

    • I used Greece and Portugal deliberately, for the very reasons you state. We once had reasonable retirement here, at 60 for women, and 65 for men. I am convinced that this is still possible, and would also help with youth unemployment. I know that North America has paid retirement plans. They also have paid medical plans. Do we want to go down that route? We need to stop thinking about being Americans, or European, and start to realise that we could have a reasonable life without wanting to be like them. The money is there, it is just being spent unwisely.
      Best wishes, Pete.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Follow-up on Dinas question about voting – I have been abroad dane in as many years (13 years – first Norway so Merseyside then Alsace) so I can’t vote do not even european – I have learned to live with this, I’m still based on political beliefs, political accountability and political morality and not in party politics – party politics I can’t see they harmonizes with my values too much hypocrisy seen from my point of view…🙂

      Like

    • We all four cannot vote either
      Bookfayries are not allowed to vote – what a shame!
      Dina as Norwegian can’t vote as our Master who is citizen of the EU already
      But we have our political opinions!

      Liked by 1 person

  3. Dear friends,
    as a Norwegian, I’m not allowed to vote, but I still have an opinion and I think this race is more nerveracking than the current football championship. Poor France, so battled and battered again.😦
    I hate kippers and I know, Dina doesn’t love them either. I love her photos, your man of voice and the banner looks very good on Church lane, hehehe.🙂
    I’ll keep my fingers crossed!
    Hugs and best wishes,
    Hjerter❤

    Liked by 2 people

    • Dear Hjerter
      thanks a lot for commenting🙂
      Well, our sign on Church Lane is a kind of revolution on Church Lane. At least we never saw a sign here before expressing a political statement.
      All the best, love and hugs xxx to our dear Norwegian friend
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

    • Dear Hjerter
      Our man of voice is Charly. Charly’s head is made of newspaper pages, which tried to manipulate him, but he is clever and decided to vote REMAIN. Charly was made by a German sprayer, who sprayed political slogans, got caught and that made him very famous (and rich).
      All the best
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

  4. Frightens me to think we may leave….all the financial difficulties that could bring, to say nothing of the workforce we will lose in our institutions, eg the NHS

    Liked by 3 people

  5. Oje, ganz schön spät mir Gedanken zu machen….
    It´s all about money, isn´t it…
    Mir geht das Gemauschel und der Lobbyismus in Brüssel (und auch sonst in der Politik) auf die Nerven, alles seeeeehr undurchsichtig, oder?!
    Die EU ist nicht Europa, aber wenn die Nachteile für England überwiegen, sollte man sich das als Engländer gut überlegen, bevor man aus diesem Verein austritt. Euros, habt ihr nicht, alles in Pfund, Deutsche Börse in London…wer soll da noch den Durchblick haben!
    Viele EU Verordnungen liegen nahe am Schwachsinn, da man eben manche Dinge nicht einem ortsunkundigen Schreibtischtäter überlassen kann….
    In Geldfragen kenne ich mich leider nicht gut aus, mache mir allerdings schon mal Sorgen, wie sich dieses Thema in Zukunft entwicklen wird…..
    Jedenfalls ein spannendes Thema, Anahatha-Grüße von Pia

    Liked by 2 people

    • Guten Morgen, liebe Pia
      Danke fürs Kommentieren. Keiner liebt die EU, aber in diesem Fall ist sie das kleinere Übel.
      Ganz liebe Grüße aus dem sonnigen Cley
      The Fab Four

      Like

  6. Being “outside”, like Norway, – my homecountry, is very often like being inside on bad conditions. Don’t think the rules and regulations are all gone, just because you are outside. It is still too regulated. At a very high cost.
    A friend of mine was running a private kindergarten in Trondheim. She gave up because of the EU regulations; the sand had to be according to to EU norms etc.
    But still, I must admit, it pleases me very much to buy an apple that looks like an apple!😉
    Good luck!
    Solveig

    Liked by 1 person

    • Unfortunately Martin Evans pinched the quotation from Lyndon Johnson who said of J Edgar Hoover (the long-serving, paranoid, right wing, cross-dressing head of the FBI) that it was “better to have him inside the tent pissing out, than outside pissing in”. Keep your enemies close. Martin was a strange man, but that is a subject for another day…

      Liked by 1 person

    • Thanks for making this clear! The origin of quotes is a most interesting tour of history.🙂
      All the best for todays historical referendum.
      Ha det,
      Solveig

      Like

    • Yes, a lot of folks here liked this quote. Quite a powerful metaphor, is’t it?!
      Linguistically quotes use to seperate from their original source and as more memorable they are as faster it goes. That’s a law of semantics.
      All the best
      Klausbernd

      Like

  7. Good luck! I don’t get to vote, either. I noticed today that the economy was bolstered in response to the most recent poll that indicates people in Britain might want to stay in the EU, after all. I guess union sounds better than disunion. Is there a bureaucratic mess? Sure. It’s the age we live in. I guess I’d like to see global community–respecting differences, celebrating unity. A daunting task, though (again) much better than the lack, let alone the reverse. My friends, let’s hope for good days now and better days to come!

    Liked by 3 people

    • Thanks for commenting.
      We agree “union sounds better than disunion” and we don’t need the EU for having a bureaucric mess in the UK.
      All the best
      The Fab four of Cley

      Like

  8. Unfortunately, I cannot vote either. A lot has been said about the economic impact, some of it probable, some of it pure speculation. To those who have hopes that England outside the EU will be able (let alone willing!) to stop the advancement of global capitalism can only say: dream on! Nothing will change here.
    Let us not forget that the main reason for the founding of the original EU (EC) was to secure peace in Europe, and this is one thing the EU has achieved. Never in its long history has Europe seen 70 years of peace. Returning to nation states to me seems regressive and dangerous, very dangerous. Strong links and shared institutions forge bonds that cannot easily be severed.
    And if one country leaves, what should stop the next one? Europe breaking up is my nightmare, with Putin looking on, smiling.
    Together we are stronger, and in these dangerous times we need all the strength we can muster.

    Liked by 3 people

    • Good morning, dear Guni,
      thanks a lot for commenting on our blog🙂
      We absolutely agree with you. Our Master is the first generation of men in Europe who wasn’t forced going to war since the middle ages.
      And England against global capitalism, well, that’s a joke.
      Have a happy day
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

  9. Can’t vote either, but would vote remain, definitely. For me EU means peace, peaceful co-operation between states. Let us never take that for granted! I love the free movement (I would never have been able to do what I do here in England had I stayed in Germany). I feel European, and I do not see that the EU poses a threat to national identities and cultures any more than anything that comes from the US. etc, etc, my list is long …

    Liked by 2 people

    • Dear Guni
      Dina and I feel European too! And we are proud of being European🙂
      Love from Church Lane
      Dina and Klausbernd
      Well, Siri and Selma feel fairishly first …

      Like

  10. I vote for a Scandinavian Federation – of which I believe we are part of. Oh, what? Sorry? That’s not on the voting form? Well since I loathe Cameron and his cronies (I cannot vote for the Tory party) and equally loathe the kippers and all they stand for, perhaps Australia will take me in at last… or maybe not.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Hey Jude,
      oh dear, the poor UK together with Norway the richest country in the world? We don’t think that Scandinavia wants the UK. On the other hand seen it historically UK and Scandinavia have a strong bond.
      Everybody we know loathes Cameron and we don’t like him as well. But Cameron and the EU are two kind of fish, even if it’s connected now.
      Thanks and love from
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

  11. Pingback: I Eat Brexits For Breakfast And Right Now I’m Very Hungary | toofulltowrite (I've started so I'll finish)

  12. The EU may have its problems, there are always problems, but the UK leaving will be a retrograde step. Moving forwards and learning to share our planet and its resources collectively should surely be the long term aim. It will be difficult and messy, but the EU is a start. Looking to the future and not the past.
    My 22 year old daughter, all her young friends and myself as ‘English and Scottish’ Europeans, will be voting to REMAIN.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Dear Agnes,
      we are happy to read that your dauhter and friends will be voting REMAIN. Great!🙂
      Thanks for commenting, greetings from Cley to the fine city of Norwich
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 2 people

  13. Ich bin gespannt, wie sich die Briten entscheiden. Ein Austritt wäre wohl sehr endgültig, da nicht einmal mehr der EWR-Status aufrechterhalten werden soll, wenn ich das neulich richtig gehört habe. Aber ich bin politisch nicht gerade bewandert.😉
    Good luck og en fin dag!😀

    Liked by 2 people

  14. per avere una qualche chanche di restare a galla in questo mondo in continuo fermento, l’Europa deve restare unita, ma devono cambiare le sue politiche e i suoi politicanti, altrimenti sarà una inutile sfida!

    Liked by 2 people

  15. I’d like to quote JK Rowling from her own website today::

    I’m not an expert on much, but I do know how to create a monster.

    All enduring fictional bad guys encapsulate primal terrors and share certain traits. Invincible to the point of immortality, they commit atrocities without conscience and cannot be defeated by the ordinary man or by conventional means. Hannibal Lecter, Big Brother, and Lord Voldemort: all are simultaneously inhuman and superhuman and that is what frightens us most.

    As this country has entered what will come to be seen as one of the most divisive and bitter political campaigns ever waged within its borders, I’ve thought a lot about the rules for creating villains. We are being asked whether we wish to remain part of the European Union and both sides of this campaign have been telling us stories. I don’t mean that in the sense of lying (although lies have certainly been told). I mean that they are appealing to us through our universal need to make sense of the world by storytelling and that they have not been afraid to conjure monsters calculated to stir up our deepest fears.

    This is nothing new, of course. All political campaigns tell stories. They cast themselves as our champions, flatter us with tales of who we are or could be, sell us rose-tinted memories of the past and draw frightening pictures of the perils that lie ahead if we pick the wrong heroes. Nevertheless, the tales we have been told during this referendum have been uglier than any I can remember in my lifetime. If anyone has enjoyed this referendum, it can only be those hoping for greater personal power at the end of it.

    The Leave campaign’s narrative has descended to this: we are being exploited or cheated by the EU. If we can’t see that Britain will only regain superpower status if we leave the union, we must be unpatriotic, cowardly or part of a corrupt elite.

    Remainers have mostly countered, not with an optimistic vision of the union, but with bleak facts: money is pouring out of the country at the prospect of the Brexit and experts in every field think that leaving the EU will be a catastrophic mistake. Be afraid, says Remain, turn back while there’s still time: you are hurtling towards a precipice.

    However, Remain are finding many ears closed to their grim prognostications. The economic crash of 2008 left a pervasive feeling in its wake that financial institutions are not to be trusted. ‘The establishment’ has become a term of blanket abuse. We live in a cynical and insecure age. Trust in disinterested sources has been shaken, while popular culture glorifies the hunch and the gut feeling. In America, they call this ‘post-truth politics’. Forget the facts, feel the fury.

    The ‘Leave’ campaign is benefiting from our widespread cynicism and, unsurprisingly, fanning it. ‘People in this country have had enough of experts,’ Michael Gove declared recently on television. So what if the Financial Times, the markets and the heads of the Bank of England and the International Monetary Fund agree that Brexit will do severe damage to the economy? They’re just scaremongering, says Gove. Leaders of both campaigns want us frightened only by monsters of their choosing.

    For some on the Leave side, the EU is not merely imperfect, or in need of improvement: it is villainous. The union that was born out of a collective desire never to see another war in Europe is depicted as an Orwellian monolith, Big Brotheresque in its desire for control. Widespread confusion about what the EU does and does not do has been helpful to Leave. The results of a recent IPSOS/Mori poll reveal the depth of our ignorance. We dramatically underestimate the amount of international investment we receive from the EU, while grossly overestimating how many laws it makes, how much it spends on administration and the number of EU immigrants in this country. In some cases our guesses were out by factors of ten.

    Immigrants, of course, have been at the centre of some of the nastiest arguments of this campaign. Reasoned discussion has proven nigh on impossible. Remainers insist that we retain border control and that we need immigration, not least because so many of our medical staff running the NHS come from abroad. They insist that our defensive capability and our anti-terrorist strategies are enhanced by membership of the EU. Their arguments have proven only partially successful, because Leave has been busy threatening us with another montster: a tsunami of faceless foreigners heading for our shores, among them rapists and terrorists.

    It is dishonourable to suggest, as many have, that Leavers are all racists and bigots: they aren’t and it is shameful to suggest that they are. Nevertheless, it is equally nonsensical to pretend that racists and bigots aren’t flocking to the ‘Leave’ cause, or that they aren’t, in some instances, directing it. For some of us, that fact alone is enough to give us pause. The picture of Nigel Farage standing in front of a poster showing a winding line of Syrian refugees captioned ‘Breaking Point’ is, as countless people have already pointed out, an almost exact duplicate of propaganda used by the Nazis.

    Nationalism is on the march across the Western world, feeding upon the terrors it seeks to inflame. Every nationalist will tell you that their nationalism is different, a natural, benign response to their country’s own particular needs and challenges, nothing to do with that nationalism of yore that ended up killing people, yet every academic study of nationalism has revealed the same key features. Your country is the greatest in the world, the nationalist cries, and anyone who isn’t chanting that is a traitor! Drape yourself in the flag: doesn’t that make you feel bigger and more powerful? Finding the present scary? We’ve got a golden past to sell you, a mythical age that will dawn again once we’ve got rid of the Mexicans/left the EU/annexed Ukraine! Now place your trust in our simplistic slogans and enjoy your rage aginst the Other!

    Look towards the Republican Party in America and shudder. ‘Make America Great Again!’ cries a man who is fascist in all but name. His stubby fingers are currently within horrifyingly close reach of America’s nuclear codes. He achieved this pre-eminence by proposing crude, unworkable solutions to complex threats. Terrorism? ‘Ban all Muslims!’ Immigration? ‘Build a wall!’ He has the temperament of an unstable nightclub bouncer, jeers at violence when it breaks out at his rallies and wears his disdain for women and minorities with pride. God help America. God help us all.

    Donald Trump supports the break up of the EU. The inheritor of a family fortune, he has never needed to cooperate or collaborate and he appears incapable of understanding complexity or nuance. Of foreign leaders or would-be leaders, Trump is joined only by Vladimir Putin and Marine le Pen in urging Brexit upon the UK. Other than those three, there is no major political leader who isn’t begging Britain to stay put, for the political and economic stability of Europe and the wider world.

    I’m the mongrel product of this European continent and I’m an internationalist. I was raised by a Francophile mother whose family was proud of their part-French heritage. My French ancestors lived in the troubled province of Alsace, which spent hundreds of years being alternately annexed by Germany and France. I’ve lived in France and Portugal and I’ve studied French and German. I love having these mulitple allegiances and cultural associations. They make me stronger, not weaker. I glory in association with the cultures of my fellow Europeans. My values are not contained or proscribed by borders. The absence of a visa when I cross the channel has symbolic value to me. I might not be in my house, but I’m still in my hometown.

    The ‘Leave’ campaign is selling itself as the courageous option. Take a leap of faith, they say. Step off the cliff and let the flag catch you! With the arrogance of a bunch of mini-Trumps they swear that everything will be glorious as long as we disregard the experts and listen to them. Embrace the rage and trust your guts, which Nigel Farage undoubtedly hopes contain a suspicion of brown people, an unthinking jingoism and an indifference to the warnings of history.

    For many of our countrymen, I suspect a ‘Leave’ vote will be a simple howl of frustration, a giant two fingers to the spectres that haunt our imaginations, against terrorism that seems almost supernatural in its ability to hit us in our most vulnerable places, against huge corporations who refuse to meet their basic moral obligations, against bureaucracy we are afraid will strangle us, against shadowy elites we are told are working to do us down. How easy to project all of this onto the EU, how satisfying to turn this referendum into a protest against everything about modern life that scares us, whether rationally or not.

    Yet how can a retreat into selfish and insecure individualism be the right response when Europe faces genuine threats, when the bonds that tie us are so powerful, when we have come so far together? How can we hope to conquer the enormous challenges of terrorism and climate change without cooperation and collaboration?

    No, I don’t think the EU’s perfect. Which human union couldn’t use improvement? From friendships, marriages, families and workplaces, all the way up to political parties, governments and cultural economic unions, there will be flaws and disagreements. Because we’re human. Because we’re imperfect. So why bother building these ambitious alliances and communities? Because they protect and empower us, because they enable bigger and better achievements than we can manage alone. We should be proud of our enduring desire to join together, seeking better, safer, fairer lives, for ourselves and for millions of others.

    The research demonstrates that we don’t know what we’ve got. Ignorant of what it gives us, we take the benefits of EU membership for granted. In a few days’ time, we’ll have to decide which monsters we believe are real and which illusory. Everything is going to come down to whose story we like best, but at the moment we vote, we stop being readers and become authors. The ending of this story, whether happy or not, will be written by us.

    Happy Solstice to all of you!

    Love, Dina

    Liked by 13 people

    • Dear Dina and I have to say Dear Rowling as well,
      it’s a pity that I can give one LIKE only, this comment deserves at least a hundred LIKEs.
      Thank you for quoting her!
      There was a GUARDIAN article of her as well, we Fab Four like very much. Unfortunately I cannot find the link now.
      I wish you all HAPPY SOLSTICE
      Klausbernd
      and we too
      Siri🙂 and Selma🙂

      Liked by 4 people

    • Rowling is an intelligent writer and makes a persuasive argument indeed. This topic has generated many comments on your blog, and most are in favour of staying in the EU, for various reasons. I am very much in the minority, for wishing to leave. You know me well-enough to realise that I do not relish the company of some of my fellow ‘leavers.’ However, there are times in life when the heart must rule, and for me, this is one of those times.
      I never intended to upset anyone with my comments, and hope that I did not cause any offence. I feel sure that the vote will end up with a ‘remain’ decision, despite the predictions of a close-run thing.
      Love from Beetley. Pete and Ollie. X

      Liked by 3 people

    • Dear Pete,
      absolutely no offence taken! We appreciate your opinion very much.
      To be quite frank, I know more NO-people in Cley and Norfolk and England than Yes-people. Therefore we thought we had to voice our opinion. This comes like a revolution on our quiet little lane.🙂
      As you know yourself, driving through Norfolk you see lots of VOTE LEAVE signs and only the past days the REMAIN signs have popped up.

      I’m in situation where I’m not allowed to vote, Guni writes the same. I studied in Cambridge and as Norwegian I was only granted a stay permit for college, I was in no position to apply for work permit.
      Now I have spent all my working life in the EU in Germany and hence, moving to England would be quite easy. Not so much however, should UK leave. So I obviously have a personal interest in UK remaining as well as as my hopes for peace and understanding.

      As I wrote to Ann Christine, I was brought up in a family who voted NO many years ago.

      Love from Cley to Beetley,
      with a big hug and a pat for Ollie,
      Dina x

      Liked by 2 people

    • I will sponsor you to move here, Dina! I am sure that all this talk of restriction of movement will come to nothing, even if the miracle happens, and Britain votes to leave. I voted No the first time, too. Look where that got us…xx

      Like

    • Wir müssen ja sagen “Hut ab vor Frau Rowling!”
      Die meisten Menschen verblöden doch unter solch großen Erfolgen, aber Frau Rowling besticht durch ihre bescheidene Klugheit.
      Das musste doch noch gesagt werden …
      Also genießt den längsten Tag
      Klausbernd🙂 und Siri🙂 und Selma🙂
      und Dina🙂 schließt sich da an.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Dear Pete,
      it may sound funny but we suppose it’s great that everyone can openly say what they think and feel here on our blog. And of course we accept your decision even if we would be more happy if you would vote for staying. Nervertheless thank you very very much for writing about your feelings in this decision!
      With lots of love from sunny Cley
      The Fab Four 🙂

      Liked by 1 person

    • P.S.
      Dear Pete
      you don’t upset and you don’t cause offence – don’t worry!
      We are happy about sharing your point of view. And isn’t that friendship that we can stand another point of view of our friends. We don’t want to get infected by this heated discussion full of hate.
      Love
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 3 people

    • What a wonderful explanatory written piece.I live in the southern hemisphere and did not understand much about this situation,but now I see a lot of things that I haven’t realized before!

      Liked by 2 people

    • “God help America. God help us all.” – I completely agree.
      Thanks, dear Dina, for quoting J.K. Rowling!
      Have a great day, with – hopefully – a good end,
      Pit

      Liked by 1 person

  16. In Sweden we are generally not happy to be inside EU – unless you are very rich and owns a big company. Which you have moved to another country…My whole family voted NO. I loathe what they have done to our farmers and our open landscape and to many other people and things and rules and all the money for nothing…Many people do not have the possibility or endurance to fill in every form needed and every issue read through and all the laws to be followed. But. The fear of Putin and global warming and terrorism and….I do not know how we shall manage without working together. But EU have to Stop telling us what to do in every tiny issue! Let us work together with the BIG issues instead of small things that are killing people’s interests and joy. So, I guess, we should stay. But EU has to be reformed. Interesting to see if Britain dares to vote NO. We cannot foresee the outcome of a NO, can we. So the fear might rule the 23rd of June.

    Liked by 4 people

    • My family voted NO! in Norway as well, Ann Christine. I must admit, I was absolutely livid to see what happened in Sweden, the big national companies moving out of the home country and collecting funds and support for creating jobs in Spain and Portugal whereas their own people back home lost their jobs. And since Norway has been outside (it was a very close run, as it was in Sweden) all the time, I’m afraid all the rules and regulations for tiny issues works for Norway as well. It’s part of the game if you want to deal with the EU. I agree with you, EU needs a reform and it will be most interesting to watch the outcome of the election.
      Warm greetings to Sweden,
      Dina

      Like

    • Thanks, dear Leya,
      I absolutely agree with you, on one hand the EU needs reforms and on the other hand no staying in the EU is the worst case for the UK. Enormous sums of capital will be transformed to other countries here as well, and the UK as a relatively poor country will suffer. Actually it has already started.
      I suppose a lot of people don’t really know what they are voting for. For a while I lived in Switzerland and, oh dear, how hard it was to do business there and how expensive everything became. Now Switzerland has special contracts with the EU – but they had to pay for it.
      If I look at all the comments here, isn’t it amazing that nearly everybody living in the EU (except the British) are for staying. They are the ones who know.
      Thanks for commenting
      All the best
      Klausbernd 🙂

      Liked by 1 person

    • Generally not happy? Is that why 7 out of 10 in Sweden want to remain in EU? (According to recent polls). Urbanization accelerated long before EU existed and was helped along by entirely home grown politics in the 50ies and 60ies. That is, our very own politicians are responsible for having forced farmers off the land. If they needed prodding at all. When it comes to bureacracy, our home grown efforts are probably more amazing than any import.

      Like

    • Dear Freddy,
      thanks again for your comment.
      We cannot understand why the “leavers” think that people in the EU are not happy with the EU. They are f.e. 70% in Germany.
      All the best
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

    • Dear Leya,
      you are right!
      The effect of the Brexit is that the acceptance of the EU within most of the EU countries has enormously grown.
      All the best
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

    • Dear…all of you. I am so shocked…we all are. Somehow we hope there is a way of solving this. In Sweden these votings are only for advice, and then the government has the final decision. Is this the possibility in UK as well? I guess not. Take care. Hugs to you all.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hello Klausbernd,
      Do you really think the acceptance of the EU had grown within mot Eurpoean countries after the Brexit? What about the Front Nationale in France and the AfD in Germany, both riding the anti-EU wave?
      Have a great remainder of the day,
      Pit

      Like

    • Hello Klausbernd,
      I’m not so sure of that. It would not be easy for the UK to come back in once they’re out, But at present, I think most European politicians would really want to keep the UK in.
      Enjoy your afternoon and evening in the little village by the big sea,
      Pit

      Liked by 1 person

    • Lieber Pit,
      diese Gruppen sind weitgehend ultra-rechte Minderheiten mit einer großen Klappe, die hochgespielt werden. Besonders die Medien stürzen sich auf sie, aber z.B. Umfragen in Deutschland zeigen, dass sie – zum Glück – keineswegs bei der breiten Bevölkerung ankommen. Und 75% Akzeptanz der EU sagt doch einiges. Vielleicht ist es in Frankreich etwas anders, aber da habe ich keine Ahnung.
      Mit ganz lieben Grüßen aus dem jetzt regnerischen Cley
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hallo Klausbernd,
      ist die Akzeptanz der EU tatsächlich so groß? Ich meine, das wesentlich geringere Zahlen gelesen zu haben.
      Liebe Grüße aus einem sonnigen und warmen Fredericksburg,
      Pit

      Like

    • Dear Pit,
      Merkel said yesterday night: Out is out. And what hear in the German news more and more politicians are happy that the UK is out and say it quiten openly.
      Well, we will see …

      We should start a new string here, otherwise we loose the overview.

      Take care
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 2 people

    • Dear Klausbernd,
      After all the resignations, maybe a new general election would be good, even necessary.
      Have a wonderful day,
      Pit

      Like

    • Guten Morgen, lieber Pit,
      es kommt sehr darauf an, von wann die Zahlen sind. Meine stammen vom letzten Politbarometer des ZDF vor einer Woche. Ich vertraue diesen Zahlen, da das Politbarometer offenlegt, wie sie zu ihren Statistiken kommen.
      Ganz liebe Grüße dir
      Klausbernd

      Like

    • Dear Pit,
      some people even speak of a new referendum. The whole British politics seems to be helpless and more and more people want to reverse the referendum. It’s quite chaotic right now and I couldn’t say where this leads to.
      Wishing you a GREAT weekend
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

  17. A united Europe without Britain is the pudding without the plum. Der Anfang vom Ende der EU, so befürchte ich. Der Austritt wäre ein Schlag ins Kontor der Europaenthusiasten und das Öl ins Feuer der Europahasser und der Kleinstaaterei. Finanzkrise, Schuldenkrise, Flüchtlingskrise. Auf diesen drei Augen werden inzwischen viel zu viele blind, um sich noch daran erinnern zu können, dass die römischen Verträge von 1957 nicht nur der wirtschaftlich zu erwartenden Prosperität geschuldet waren, sondern auch dem brüderlichen Willen zum Frieden in Europa. Don`t go.

    Liked by 5 people

  18. Ich bin aich für dabeibleiben, ich glaube nicht, dass sich GB mit dem Ausstieg einen wirklichen gefallen tut, nach allem, was ich in den letzten Tagen dazu las. Ja, die EU hat Probleme und das satt, es gilt die Probleme anzugehen, statt wegzulaufen, macht man das nicht so?

    herzliche Grüsse und auch meine Daumen sind gedrückt
    Ulli

    Liked by 3 people

    • Guten Tag, liebe Ulli,
      danke für deine Unterstützung! 🙂 Und fürs Daumendrücken, das wir sehr benötigen!
      Liebe Grüße aus dem sonnigen Garten
      The Fab Four of Cley
      🙂🙂🙂🙂

      Liked by 1 person

  19. I was a firm beliver in Leave, but it doesn’t feel rock solid any longer. I’ll vote by heart . There’ll be a day afer the day after tomorow and then we’ll see. Can’t wait to get over with this referendum.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Dear Pete
      I am not so sure if voting by heart is the right thing to do. In history it always ended in deasaster when emotions took over politics. As Germans we have experienced this like the Italians at the beginning of WW II and wasn’t it very emotional before every great war in Europe. Therefore I am very sceptical to combine emotions with politics. At least for me politics is a case for the intellect, for analysis and for keeping cool.
      Thanks for commenting
      Klausbernd 🙂

      Like

    • Aaaauuuuuaaauuuuaaa, ich Jane, du Tarzan, hääh?
      Das verstehe ich nicht, gibt es keine klugen Herzen? Herz=Emotion?!
      Ich denke, dass ist ein Denkfehler. (fragt mal eine Mutter)
      Kommt diese ganze politische Unkorrektheit nicht erst durch diesen herzlosen Denkansatz und dieses merkwürdige Menschenbild?!

      Allerdings finde ich auch, dass übertriebene und irrationale Emotionen bei politischen und sonstigen Entscheidungen zu keinem guten Ergebnis führen werden….
      Aber einfach rational berechnen und zusammen bringen oder halten wollen, was nicht zusammen gewachsen ist, ist ziemlich anstrengend und steht auf wackeligen Füßen oder?
      Schon in kleinsten “Einheiten” funktioniert das gemeinsame Teilen, Verwalten und Verdienen von Geld nicht….
      Das Zusammenfügen von etwas bedeutet auch das Ausschließen, gleichzeitig…

      If the Russians love their children too, eine absolute Anmaßung so ein Lied zu singen!
      Jeder Tischtennisverein, jeder Schüleraustausch, jeder Gesangsverein, jeder, der sich innereuropäisch und weltweit trifft, tut mehr für den Weltfrieden, von Mensch zu Mensch, von Herz zu Herz…

      Mögen sich unsere Schulsysteme wandeln, dass Kinder den wirklichen Zusammenhang all dieser Ereignisse erkennen dürfen und ja, natürlich auch ihre kulturellen Wurzeln achten lernen, sich aber hoffentlich zu intelligenten, herzlichen Menschen entwickeln dürfen…
      Lucas 11 Jahre, gestern in Ballettsaal: Weißt du Pia, wenn ich meinen Freunden einfach so zuhöre, die merken nicht, wie manipuliert sie sind..
      Das rührte mich wieder einfach zu Tränen..
      Schauen wir mal morgen, Eng-land oder Engel-land?
      Zu pathetisch? Zu emotional? Zu naiv und weltfremd? Egal!
      Werden wir uns bewusst, bitte, hoffentlich!

      Like

    • Liebe Pia,
      das Herz hat seinen Platz und der Kopf hat seinen Platz. Wenn Massen nach dem Herz entscheiden, dann wollen sie den totalen Krieg wie im Berliner Sportpalast oder das vita periculosa wie auf die Frage Musolinis. Die brüllen “Wir sind das Volk” würden auch sagen, dass sie sich ihrem Herz entsprechend so verhalten. Ich würde sagen, nichts ist so manipulierbar wie das Herz. Auf das in der Politik zu vertrauen, bringt, wie die historischen Beispiele zeigen, stets Mord und Totschlag.
      Und hier hier im UK ist so kurz vor dem Referendum die Stimmung streitbar emotional, da auf das Herz statt auf den Verstand gehört wird.
      Liebe Grüße vom Meer
      Klausbernd

      Like

    • Oje, das klingt ja grauenvoll, auf ein manipuliertes “Herz” also hören sie und denken, dass ihre Emotionen ihnen zu einer “guten” Entscheidung helfen. horrible….
      Wie sollen wir also ihr Gehirn und ihren Verstand erreichen?
      Jedenfalls versucht ihr es mit diesem großartigen Blogbeitrag!
      Dann hoffen wir mal, dass “Stay” sich morgen durchsetzt und man weiter an den Verbesserungen des Zusammenseins arbeiten kann….
      Liebe Grüße zurück!

      ..sorry, gerade ist der Juniorchef unserer Bank über den Platz gelaufen, schnieke im Anzug, er hat so einen niedlichen Tick beim Sprechen., steht ganz schön unter Druck, aber er strahlt auch diese typische “ich mache alles richtig-Energie” aus und glaubt er macht “Karriere”, hat Mutti es so empfohlen? Im Gegensatz zu der Frau bei der anderen Bank, die mir vor einiger Zeit einen völlig irrsinnigen Rentenvertrag verkauft hat, sie ist nur noch ein Schatten ihrer selbst….hat da Kleinpia nicht aufgepasst und sich etwas aufschwatzen lassen, ja!

      Ich wünsche England morgen viel Kraft beim Wählen des “kleineren Übels” und glaube fest daran, dass sich alles zum Guten entwickeln wird und wir lernen und leben und koche jetzt mal Mittagessen.
      Oje, es hat ja schon so mancher aufs falsche Pferd gesetzt!

      Like

    • oje, Ohrwurm.. bin gerade wieder völlig fertig. Aphrodite´s Child setzen sich aus Demis Roussos und Vangelis zusammen, ja bin ich denn echt so doof, dass ich das nicht wusste?
      In der Schweiz kann man ja aus der Asche von Verstorbenen einen Diamanten für seinen Finger haben, ist in Deutschland verboten..
      ….gehe jetzt wieder tanzen…dann habe ich Ruhe vor meinen Gedanken und ihr auch….
      Drücke die Daumen für Morgen, viel Druck!

      Like

    • Dear Leya
      it’s the same in the UK the votes are for advice only and the government can decide. In the UK Parliament 75% of the members are pro-EU but we suppose they don’t dare to decide against the vote.
      With lots of love
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

  20. I’m impressed by the debate here. As a german I was never ever asked anyway. Still i think the EC is good in grand total.
    What made the EC bad was the NeoLiberalism, in my eyes. But, i dare say to all Leavers: you will not get back the world before the deteriorations just by leaving the EC, nobody will – look at the other nations not in the community, are they really better off? I suspect, they also suffer from the dictate in the multinational banks and other companies whatsoever. Monsanto will dictate their seeds anyway. Bigger elected communities are the only match to them, not smaller ones. Volkswagen will still sell most cars, Nestle will sell most food, Apple will sell most Smartphones, and the NSA will capture all our internet traffic. This all will never be matched by small countries alone. It can be debated in the EC parliament, maybe.
    And, to the honesty it is to be said, that not all EC politics were bad, and also not all local politics were selflessly good. In fact, very often when we hear in northern Germany of things done in Bavaria (as an example), say about schooling, we would rather have the EC outrule our ageold school system, and get rid off the stupid 3-tiered-system that only favours the rich. Instead of that we even have a more stupid system in Bavaria, forcing pupils of the lowest classes already to coaching. So much to the myth of “better local politics”.Every parent here fears moving to bavaria if kids are involved. The Alps are no substitute for equal chances.

    Liked by 3 people

    • Thank you very vey much for your clever commentary!
      We agree, it’s an illusion that one small country will outrule big industry. Leaving probably means being even more in the hands of multinational companies. And I think, as you, that not all EU regulations are stupid, not at all.
      A farmer growing apples in Southwest-Germany told me, growing apples before the EU he had to follow a lot of regulations by the farmer’s cooperative, in the EU he had to follow the regulations by the EU. Where’s the difference?
      All the best
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

    • Sure, we did not have a referendum in Germany. But we did have elections, didn’t we, in which we chose a parliament that would vote for joining the EU.

      Like

  21. OK…everyone for himself…but not playing hardball…at least you are one nation, friends not enemies…
    I´m a stranger as german, but tend to flirt with -vote LEAVE- , cause I dislike Mr. J.C. Juncker, he’s not a man of honour…
    but Ìt’s a strangers vote and a single dissent…
    last but not least…have a good thursday…all england and UK…😉

    Liked by 2 people

    • Well, well, as you wrote yourself disliking Juncker is not really a reason for voting “leave”.
      By the way as a EU citizen I am not allowed to vote, well in a way I am a stranger too but living in the UK for more 35 years now.
      Thanks and cheers
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 1 person

  22. Human beings make great plans, and as soon as they are done with one, they start another. In the end, all we leave behind are tombstones. I know too little about this debate to add anything of value, but I’m sure no matter what the outcome, the sun will rise on the Fab Four tomorrow. Be of light hearts.🙂

    Liked by 2 people

  23. I do understand Beetley Pete’s argument but cannot agree with his voting intention. I am a socialist and agree fully about the EU’s limitations and capitalist focus. However in Britain the Brexit debate seems to be more about a Conservative/Ukip schism that would bring about an even more right-wing government if the Remain campaign fails. Farage is undeniably odious and given far too much air time considering that he doesn’t even have a parliamentary seat – this ‘man of the people’, a public-school bully and ex-banker, talks of a Westminster elite but he IS part of the elite. As for Johnson, I think he would argue just as vehemently for the other side if there was any political capital to be made such is his conniving, ruthless ambition. The EU has given us some good things – workers rights, environmental laws etc – much of which we take for granted. Ideology is one thing but I feel here we must choose the lesser of two evils. Please vote Remain.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Good morning, dear Laurence,
      thank you so much for your helpful commentary. We agree and are very happy about your remarks! 🙂
      With warm greetings from Cley to Norwich
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

  24. I’m not allowed to vote, but I do read the odd English newspaper and when
    the Daily Mail, The Daily Express, The Sun, UKIP and the British National Party all urge the citizens of UK to leave, that’s a reason good enough for me to STAY.😉

    Liked by 2 people

    • Dear Per Magnus,
      your commentary is worth a thousand LIKEs!
      That’s one of the best arguments I read 😉
      Wishing you a great evening
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

  25. Hallo Ihr Lieben “hoffentlich-noch-lange-Europaer”,
    eine ganz interessanten Artikel zum “Brexit” [wie naemlich ganz Irrationales die Entscheidung beeinflusst] habe ich gerade hier [http://tinyurl.com/jjzswtz] in der “Welt” gefunden.
    Ich bin gespannt auf morgen, wirklich.
    Macht’s gut,
    Pit

    Liked by 2 people

    • Hi, lieber Pit,
      herzlichen Dank für diesen Link zur “Welt”. Mir scheint es fast, dass die meisten, zumindest die, die sich für OUT entscheiden, sich völlig vom Irrationalen lenken lassen. Naja und als Deutscher weiß man ja aus der Geschichte, dass das Volk seinen Untergang zu wählen pflegt, wenn es emotional entscheidet. Wir alle vier hoffen sehr, dass UK Teil der EU bleibt. Kurzum, dass die Vernunft siegt.
      Bei euch würde ja Trump es begrüßen, wenn UK austräte. Ist nicht das alleine Grund genug, Teil der EU zu bleiben?!
      Bitte gaaaanz ganz fest die Daumen halten!
      Mit lieben Grüßen vom kleinen Dorf am großen Meer
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hallo Klausbernd,
      natürlich halte ich die Daumen. Gerade habe ich leider lesen müssen, dass die Befürworter des Brexit aufgeholt haben, und dass es jetzt ein Kopf-an-Kopf Rennen ist. Hoffentlich kommt das nicht so.
      Aber: lt. diesem Artikel [http://tinyurl.com/hmywqxy], ebenfalls aus der Welt, darf das Parlament das Ergebnis des Referendums ignorieren. Dieser Artikel meint sogar, das sei wahrscheinlich, zumindest bei einem knappen Ergebnis für den Brexit bei gleichzeitig geringer Wahlbeteiligung [von etwa 50%], weil dann nur etwa 25% der Briten für den Brexit gestimmt haetten, und weil im Parlament die große Mehrheit für “remain” ist.
      Du hast Recht: wenn Trump für den Brexit ist, dann muss ein Brexit Unsinn sein. Aber Ihr habt ja Euren eigenen Trump, den Wirrkopf [im wörtlichen wie im übertragenen Sinne] Boris Johnson. Apropos Trump: mir wird Angst und Bange für Amerika. Ich kann nur hoffen, dass die Republikaner sich selbst ins Knie schießen und bei den demokraten Clinton und Sanders sich einigen. Da sehe ich noch ein echtes Problem. Der alte Sturkopf Sanders sollte zusehen, dass er seine guten Ideen – schließlich hat er ja wirklich welche – in die Plattform der Demokraten einbringt und dass er seine Clientel dazu bringt, für Hillary zu stimmen. Eine(n) zwischen Clinton und Sanders zerrissenen Partei(tag) können wir am wenigsten brauchen. Ich habe schon (junge) Demokraten! sagen hören, sie würden lieber Trump als Hillary wählen. Wie war das noch mit dem Sprichwort, dass nur die dümmsten Kaelber sich ihren Schlächter selber wählen?!
      So, jetzt aber genug davon! Seien wir mal Optimisten.
      Liebe Grüße, auch an die liebe Dina und an die beiden Buchfeen, und auch von Mary,
      Pit
      P.S.: Ich fand es übrigens sehr interessant, dieses Posting in Eurem ansonsten apolitischen Blog zu lesen. Aber gut! Apropos Blog(gen): da muss ich noch auf Deine Kommentare/Mails anworten. Kommt noch.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Guten Morgen, lieber Pit,
      also, du Lieber, wir verstehen uns nicht als apolitisch. Siehe z.B.:
      https://toffeefee.wordpress.com/2015/01/09/nous-sommes-charlie/
      https://toffeefee.wordpress.com/2015/01/29/cologne-nous-ne-pas-sommes-charlie/
      Aber wir geben nicht unseren Senf zu jedem irrelevanten politischen Geplänkel. Jedoch denken wir, eine gewisse progressiv emanzipatorische – oder sollte man es neuzeitlich sozialistische Grundhaltung nennen? – stellt bei uns den Hintergrund zu jedem dieser Essays auf unserem Blog dar. Man könnte auch sagen, wir verstehen uns als moderne Aufklärer.
      Ja, heute ist ein höchst aufregender Tag für uns. Wir hoffen schwer, dass UK in der EU bleibt – aber das sagten wir ja schon.
      Ganz liebe Grüße an dich und Mary
      The Fab Four of Cley
      bei denen selbst die Feen gewisse politische Vorstellungen haben 😉

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hallo Klausbernd,
      ok, nicht vollkommen apolitisch, aber – und das gefaellt mir so – das Politische steht nicht im Vordergrund Eures Blogs.
      Macht’s gut,
      Pit

      Like

    • Post Scriptum
      Da hat Masterchen doch noch glatt etwas vergessen:
      Unser Pappmaché-Mensch, dessen Kopf aus Zeitungen besteht, heißt auch Charly (allerdings mit Y). Und obwohl sein Kopf von den Zeitungen manipuliert ist, wählt er doch STAY, er ist eben ein kluger Charly, der die verschiedenen Nachrichten abwägen kann. Übrigens stammt er von Daim, einem Renegaten der Sprayer, der so berühmt wurde (nach seinem Prozess von der Bahn), dass er heute auf Leinwand sprayed und von Galerien weltweit vertreten wird. Masterchen bekam Charly von ihm geschenkt.
      Ganz liebe Grüße und viel Feenhauch über das große Wasser
      Siri und Selma
      die heute auf Masterchens Rechner schreiben durften 🙂🙂

      Liked by 2 people

    • Hallo Siri, hallo Selma,
      danke für diese Information zu Eurem Pappkerl – der mir übrigens prima gefaellt. 😉
      Liebe Grüße, auch an den Master und die liebe Dina,
      Pit

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hi, lieber Pit,
      da hast du Recht, wir melden uns nur dezidiert politisch zu Wort, wenn wir es für unbedingt nötig halten.
      Und so blöd, dass es dieses Mal nichts genutzt hat 😦
      Naja, wir werden so weiter machen.
      Schönes Wochenende dir wünschen
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

    • Nein, Ihr lieben Flatterwesen, ich sag’s nicht weiter. 😉 Aber vielleicht bekommt Ihr ja mal einen eigenen Rechner. Gibt’s so etwas im Feenreich? 😉
      Habt’s fein,
      Pit

      Liked by 1 person

    • Lieber Pit
      soooooo lieb von dir.💖 Ja, wir haben beide je unseren MacFee, aber, wie gerade jetzt, den haben wir immer oben in unserem Gemütlichkeitszimmer. Und da sind wir zu faul hochzuflattern, und wenn Masterchen anders beschäftigt ist, huschen wir schnell an seinen Rechner.
      Viel Feenhauch von uns
      👭
      Siri und Selma

      Liked by 1 person

    • Dear Robert
      Thank you very much!
      Well, the outcome of the referendum will have an effect on the US for sure. Therefore Trump is supporting the LEAVE campaign – enough reason to vote STAY.
      By the way we are not allowed to vote as well: Dina is Norwegian and I am German and Bookfayries are not allowed to vote too.
      All the best
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

    • I hope the wave of xenophobia and negativity in the U.S. has peaked, too. People opposed to Trump portray his supporters as unthinkingly negative, irrationally emotional, and purely xenophobic. But I hope in Britain & the U.S., that this drives home the recognition that millions of people feel the central bureaucracies are arrogant, unreasonable, and unresponsive. The U.S. needs proper gastarbeiter programs, I hope I’m using that word correctly, I mean, guest-workers, including provisions for health care, and a less chaotic process for immigration. We do not have the apprentice programs that Germany does, our educational system is grossly unfair, and our re-training programs for “redundant” workers are ineffective. People have turned to Trump in part because of Wall Street’s destructive manipulations and the billionaires’ successful evasion of taxes.
      So we need to pay attention and respond to what is causing such a depth of hatred and negativity, but instead hear only sarcasm and mockery, not real initiatives.
      I thought J.K.Rowling’s commentary was excellent, and it has been fascinating to read the comments on your post. You have an interesting and varied readership, and they write such thoughtful responses. congratulations! And thank you.

      Liked by 3 people

    • Dear Robert
      the reason of people voting LEAVE are quite similar to those supporting Trump, ironically Boris Johnson looks a bit like Trump 😉
      The EU with their regulations supports a basic social system, culture and protecting environment. A UK without the EU will become like the US. Anyway, today is the day …
      Thank you very much for your kind words about our readership. We are very proud that everybody can express their ideas here in a civilized way. That is the highest aim of our blog: free speech without aggression.
      All the best
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

    • Local democracy is an outdated and cute dream in the face of big blocks in politics and economy.
      Here we can see the big differences in the expression beween the OUT and IN followers. The aggression in the verbalisation says everything, doesn’t it?! I don’t want to be ruled by such people.
      Klausbernd 🙂

      Liked by 4 people

    • Well, personally I don’t give a shit about your opinion. I wasn’t trying to convince anyone, people rarely change their opinions anyway. I was just expressing my opinion.

      Like

    • Oh no! Someone is wrong on the internet. Good thing you came to the resque Buchdame.
      BTW: Isn’t it typical that simple minds puts everyone in the same box? All blacks are like this, all LEAVE supporters are like that, all Asians are etc, etc.

      Like

    • There’s one point in which I agree with you: the generalizing statement “all … are” is (nearly) always wrong. But then, “f*** …” is only an “argument” in the mind of extremists.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Die Nachteile liegen besonders auf dem Gebiet des Handels und somit der Preise für die Konsumenten. Norwegen hat ja eines der höchsten Preisniveaus der Welt und trotz hoher Löhne klagen viele Menschen, dass sie knapp mit ihrem Geld zurechtkommen, übrigens ebenso wie in der Schweiz. Andersherum ausgedrückt, das Realeinkommen sinkt, und das wird natürlich noch im stärkeren Maße im UK geschehen, da alle wesentlichen Industrien dort ausverkauft wurden im Gegensatz zu Norwegen.
      Aber Dina wird sicher noch mehr darüber schreiben können.
      Alles Gute, schönen Abend
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 2 people

  26. well, well, ich besitze keine Aktien, überlege noch, ob ich vielleicht mal meinen Taufschein verbrenne, letzte Woche musste ich über ein Mädchen lachen, sie fragte sich, warum ich neben die Blumenvase im Ballettsaal einen kleinen “Kelch” mit Wasser stelle: O , Weinwasser, warum hast du das hier hingestellt Pia? (sie war erst 5 Jahre alt..hat sie etwas falsch verstanden?)

    3mal hatte ich letztes Jahr meinen Personalausweis verloren, letzte Woche wollte ich die Norfolk-Tasse aus dem Schrank holen, guess what, der Henkel ist abgebrochen, jetzt kann ich es euch ja erzählen…
    Ich möchte keine Chips in meinem Körper, was gibt es hier zu diskutieren?!
    Ok, Narrhalla-Marsch, Adolphe Adam will turn around in his grave now!
    Much Love from Pia, the Dancing Woman, keep on dancing and relaxing! And blogging of course…

    Like

    • Liebe Pia,
      ich nehme an, der Austritt des UK aus der EU wird jeden in der EU und freilich mehr noch im UK treffen.
      Jetzt kann man nur fürs Beste hoffen, dass sich nämlich UK und die EU möglichst schnell einigen werden.
      Etwas geschockt.
      Liebe Grüße aus Cley
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hallo Pia,
      “keep on dancing”? Zusammen mit dem UK wäre das gut gewesen. Ohne, fürchte ich, könnte es ein Totentanz (fpr die EU) werden. Und bei dem Gedanken kann ich wirklich nicht relaxen.
      LG,
      Pit

      Liked by 1 person

    • Da hast du leider Recht, lieber Pit!
      Galgenhumor?
      Oder einfach die Erkenntnis, dass man sich so manchem, “ko(s)mischen” Tanz nicht entziehen kann, Leben wie ein Tanz, ohne Tanz/Bewegung kein Leben…
      Fühle schon so lange, dass man entspannt vielleicht noch eine Chance hat, nicht zu ängstlich in die Zukunft zu schauen und weiter positive Pläne kreieren kann und seine Kraft noch hat, wenn sie gebraucht wird.
      Entspannt im Sinne von nicht panisch…
      Schönes Wochenende dir!

      Liked by 1 person

    • Lieber Pit,
      ich bin ziemlich geschockt! Ich hätte nicht gedacht, dass viele Engländer so b…d sein könnten. Sofort verlor das GBP 7%, geschieht ihnen Recht 😉 Du weißt doch, Schadenfreude … OH DEAR!
      Übrigens typisch: Cambridge, Oxford und London war für den Verbleib in der EU und ganz Schottland, das jetzt einen euen Anlauf zu seiner Unabhängigkeit macht. Wo die Gebildeten wohnten, war man durchweg für die EU.
      Ganz liebe Grüße
      Klausbernd und Siri und Selma, die ihre weisen Feenhäupter schütteln

      Liked by 1 person

    • Dear Klausbernd,
      What, If I remember all the comments here correctly, none of the commentators has mentioned is that it’s neither the British people in a referendum, nor the Prime Minister (and his government) who decide on the question whether to leave the EU or not, but that that requires an act of parliament. Raises interesting questions, doesn’t it? Especially as, if I’m correct, the pro-Europeans there have a majority, and it was “only” about 35% of the electorate that voted to leave. Not that I have any hope, though.
      Have a good time, whatever happens,
      Pit

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hallo Klausbernd,
      ich koennte jetzt ja sagen, dass ich von einem niedrigeren Kurs des Pfund nur profitiere. Aber erstens ist der Euro ja auch abgestuerzt und mein Gehalt in Dollar daher weniger, und zweitens ist der Oelpreis, von dem Marys und mein Einkommen zu einem nicht geringen Teil abhaengt, auch abgestuerzt. Aber im Ernst, Beides war im Vorfeld – und ist es auch jetzt noch – von geringerer Bedeutung als der Auftrieb, den nun die Fliehkraefte in Europa bekommen werden.
      Mal sehen, was wird.
      Haltet die Ohren steif,
      Pit

      Like

    • Ja, wir könnten auch sagen, der niedrige Pfund-Kurs bringt uns Vorteile. Auf der anderen Seite sehe ich große Teuerungen auf uns zukommen. Das UK wird ja überschwemmt von deutschen Waren von Autos bis zu Lebensmittel. Das wird sich sicher alles verteuern.
      Auf der anderen Seite, denke ich mir, hängt nun alles davon ab, wie schnell UK mit der EU verhandelt und zu einer Einigung kommen wird. Wenn sie sich schnell einigen, wird das GBP wohl wieder leicht steigen, falls nicht, wird es weiter absinken. Es geht ja um die Zahlungen von etwa 15 Milliarden € jährlich, um an der Freihandelszone teilzuhaben. Das ist der Preis des Brexit.
      Wie der fallende Ölpreis mit dem Brexit zusammenhängt, ist mir dunkel.
      Anyway, wir werden sehen.
      Bei uns geht erst einmal alles weiter wie gewohnt.
      Ganz liebe Grüße
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hallo Klausbernd,
      wie das genau mit dem Ölpreis und dem Brexit ist, weiß ich auch nicht. Es scheint aber so zu sein, dass man eine möglicherweise weltweite Rezession beförchtet. Und die würde dann den Ölbedarf reduzieren. Und wir haben ja ihnehin schon ein Überangebot.
      Aber genau wie bei Eich: es geht weiter wie gewohnt.
      Habt’s fein,
      Pit

      Like

  27. I live very far from UK. Nonvoting: inside or outside; but anyway I read with great interest this post, the opinion of people expressed here give me a closer view of this situation.
    As an observer I say that what happens with this will bring very interesting consequences. We’ll see how this story continues

    Liked by 1 person

    • Dear Walter,
      we suppose a lot of people voting OUT weren’t aware of the consequences or as somebody said yesterday, “now after the Brexit the British start googleing the consequences.”
      The GBP fell 7%, the share index fell nearly 10% and the oilprice as well. For the UK more consequences will follow.
      Wishing you a happy weekend
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hello Klausbernd,
      It sure looks like many people in GB – I don’t know, though, if it’s those who voted for a Brexit – are having second thoughts. I’ve just read that within hours after the referendum 1.2 million people signed an online petition for a new referendum. That’s ten times the number sufficient to force Parliament to consider that petition [which it will do on Tuesday].
      As to the fact that supposedly millions of Britons started googleing the consequences only after the referendum: that’s, to the best of my knowledge, wrong. That idea is based on not regarding the time zones of Google.
      Well, whatever is going to happen: we certainly live in interestig times. 😉
      Have a great weekend, and best regards to the other “three quarters of the Fabulous Four”,
      Pit
      P.S.: What I had already thought immediately after the refendum has become true. Now the secessionists here in Texas are claiming for a referndum on the secession of Texas from the US. Btw, they’re as uninformed as many of the British who voted for a Brexit: there’s nothing in the Constitution that would allow Texas to secede. But as usual: stupidity prevails. Or, as my mother always said, :”Gegen Dummheit kämpfen selbst Götter vergebens.”

      Liked by 1 person

  28. Another – lighter – thought: have the “leave” supporters taken into account that, if the Brexit comes, about 100 of the soccer players in the English Premier League would have to leave because their work permit would no longer be legal as it now is under EU regulations?

    Liked by 1 person

  29. Alas, they voted to leave. It’ll surely be a rude awakening when the British begin to understand that all the ills in the world does not come from the EU nor will jobs magically appear once they leave, the sun will not shine brighter and taxes will not be lowered. In a global world it’s a laughable notion that a nation state is in complete control of its own economy and destiny. North Korea has tried. Not a convincing success.

    Liked by 1 person

  30. I regret I do not share your analogy. I am a ‘leaver’, not because of any Little Englander complex, or to relive the Imperial past. No, in spite of my years I am a believer in the future, and those problems the Norwegian Prime Minister spoke of are exactly what our over-fat, complacent country needs. They are about life. They are what life is about. Let us watch, in the next six months, a year, exactly what happens next – both within the ‘tent’ (although I cannot follow that description of the Brussels Federal cabal) and outside it. What has happened in UK is what was soon to happen in Greece, in Spain, in Italy, and possibly even in France. We were just the first; the innovators, as usual. In its current shape the EU is torpid and going nowhere; we were destined to find ourselves moored to the ship as it sank. Maybe now the hard minds of the EU will, if you forgive my trading analogies ‘wake up and smell the coffee’.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Dear Frederick,
      thank you for representing the leavers. As you know I am against leaving. Well, we already see the consequences as the GBP is falling and today it is down 8% against the Dollar already (forecasted 12% by the end of this week). FatFreddy has explained the problems quite well. UK is a country sold out most of its important industries which is already reaching a situation it cannot decide anything for itself since the Brexit. The decisions will be made by the finance markets and there the UK has lost its power now.
      Of course the EU is far from being ideal, but to my undestanding it’s better to be in group of countries than being alone especially if you are not an economically strong country like Germany (in the EU) or Norway and Switzerland.
      Not being in the EU will have a lot of consequences for the everyday life – for NHS, for culture and evironment. Not mentioning Scotland …
      In many EU countries the people like to be in the EU. It’s only minorities of the ultra-right movement who are against it. You could see that on the election in Spain yesterday (no anti-EU group had a chance), in Germany nearly 70% of the people like to be in the EU (statistics from two days ago). In the British media those groups which are against the EU are presented as being much stronger than they actually are. I read German, Swedish, Norwegian and Dutch papers regularly and the situation is presented quite differently from the British press. Sorry to write this, but to my understanding the leavers followed a populist campaign. And it should make them think that all the ultra-right movements in the world incuding IS applauded their decision.
      But thanks again for presenting your point of view.
      Should I say enjoy the Brexit?
      All the best
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 1 person

    • Frederick,
      Thanks for presnting your views. To take up your analogy of the ship: I agree that the “ship EU”is in a very bad shape and has an incompetent management, but maybe it’ll still float and those who jumped ship will drown. That scenario, I’m afraid, cannot be ruled out completely at present. I still believe it would have better for not to leave but stay on board and help repair things. Which, I fervently hope, can still be done. We certainly need a unified Europe to make it better.
      Best regards,
      Pit

      Liked by 1 person

  31. Hallo Klausbernd,
    gerade bin ich bei meiner allmorgendlichen “Zeitungstour” und lese Nachrichten. Und was könnte es anders sein als zum “Brexit”. Na ja, größtenteils wenigstens. Auch die deutsche Fußballnationalmannschaft [juhu, wir haben gewonnen!] interessiert natürlich ungemein. Und Hiesiges auch.
    Aber jetzt zum Brexit: In der NYT lese ich gerade [http://tinyurl.com/zwbs6kw], dass möglicherweise auch die Regionalparlamente von Schottland, Wales und Nordirland einem Brexit zustimmen müssten. Die Gelehrten sind sich zwar nicht einig, weil das UK ja nun mal keine kodifizierte Verfassung hat, aber es gibt eben auch unter Staatsrechtlern diese Meinung.
    Hoffen wir nur, dass das Ganze keine unendliche Geschichte wird. Was ich bisher zwar gelesen, aber gar nicht richtig registriert habe, ist, dass Cameron gesagt hat, er wolle die Verhandlungen seinem Nachfolger überlassen, aber erst in drei Monaten zurücktreten. Ob er da insgeheim hofft, die EU würde sich doch noch zu Verhandlungen über Verbesserungen bereit finden? Auf dieser Linie scheint mir Boris Johnson im Augenblick zu reiten.
    So, jetzt geht’s wieder zu meinem Morgenkaffee.
    Euch noch einen feinen Restmontag,
    Pit

    Liked by 1 person

    • Hier ist nun Nachmittag, also guten Tag, lieber Pit,
      ich glaube, keiner weiß so richtig, was nun in der nächsten Zeit geschehen wird. Da gibt eine nicht unerhebliche Gruppe, die ein neues Referendum will, Schottland will ein neues Referendum über seine Unabhängigkeit und das Pfund fällt und fällt (was gewisse Vorteile für uns hat).
      Viele der “leavers” haben jetzt erst verstanden, wofür sie gestimmt haben, die Konsequenzen ihres Votums schienen vielen nicht klar gewesen zu sein.
      Außerhalb des UK z.B. in Deutschland bekommt die EU viel Zustimmung seit dem Brexit (laut Statistiken des 2. Deutschen Fernsehens). Ich vermute nicht, dass die EU noch mehr Zugeständnisse macht. Es entwickelt eine Haltung hin, die damals Charles de Gaulle gegenüber einen Beitritt des UK zu Europäischen Union machte: Wir wollen sie nicht, da sie immer nur Sonderwünsche haben. Es gibt ja inzwischen einige Gruppen z.B. in Deutschland, die sich freuen, dass nun nicht mehr das chronisch nörgelnde UK in der EU ist.
      Wie sich das alles entwickeln wird? Ich habe keine Ahnung. Aber z.Zt. is business as usual – nur dass es für uns merklich billiger geworden ist.
      Ganz liebe Grüße vom kleinen Dorf am großen Meer
      Klausbernd und vom Rest der Fab Four

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hallo Klausbernd,
      und dann hatten wir zu allem Überfluss heute auch noch den zweiten “Brexit” und das kleine Island schießt England aus der Fußballeuropmeisterschaft. Na ja, nicht ganz “Brexit, weil es ja nur England war und nicht das UK. Aber trotzdem! Also auch hier, für England, “Aus der Traum.”
      Macht’s gut und haltet Euch wacker,
      Pit

      Like

    • Gern geschehen, lieber Klausbernd.🙂 Da ich mir mit dieser Antwort (viel) Zeit gelassen habe, habe ich ja auch schon Dina’s Posting dazu gelesen und frage mich, was man an ihren Aufnahmen denn überhaupt noch verbessern kann, so exzellent wie die schon jetzt sind.
      Liebe Grüße aus den nicht minder verrückten USA, 😉
      Pit

      Liked by 1 person

    • Guten Morgen, lieber Pit,
      ach weißt du, Dina ist sehr ehrgeizig und so findet sie stets noch etwas, das zu verbessern ist, und sie liebt es, Neues zu lernen.
      Huch, hier frischt der Wind mächtig auf.
      Vom kleinen Dorf am großen Meer gaaanz liebe Grüße
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

  32. You’ve had a bloodless revolution, and you are now hungover, it seems to me. In the US, our elections are designed to give us bloodless revolutions that shake up the status quo every two or four years. Watching Trump campaign seems like a revolution of sorts.

    I’m as worried about Brexit as anyone else, and I have a half-hope that they will repent, revote and opt to stay. If not, let’s hope some good comes of this vote, even if the consequences now seem dire. Perhaps the UK might even come to appreciate the other European nations. Although that seems so unlikely given what one reads in the press.

    We have sections of our country that talk of seceding, but no one is inclined to let that happen now. What a disaster if we had to have another war on that issue, here or anywhere.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Dear Brenda,
      everything coming in from the EU will be taxed. I had this problem when I lived in Switzerland. The effect: everything from the EU will be more expensive.
      LOL
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 1 person

    • Dear Pit,
      oh dear, I wrote this comment answering Brenda, but to answer you:
      London wants to split from the UK, in a way it’s a joke, but people discuss it, and that Scotland will leave the UK is very likely- so why not Texas leaving the US?
      LOL
      Kb

      Liked by 1 person

    • Dear Brenda,
      we hope for the best that Trump will not win.
      Here a lot of people already regret having voted for LEAVE. But I don’t see that this vote will be reversed – although the parliament could do it and there are 75% of the members pro-EU. Cameron is speaking of “our European friends” since Brexit but the problem is that there are quite a lot of influencial politicions in the EU don’t want the UK anymore.
      All the best
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 1 person

    • Brenda,
      Not that I want to justify those who voted for leave or for Trump, but both camps, to a certain amount, are the result of leading politicians in the EU or in the US respectively loosing contact with and understanding for the “common” man.
      Have a great day,
      Pit

      Liked by 1 person

    • Dear Brenda
      not only that simple but expensive as well. Norway pays 10 billion € for trading with the EU and the UK will pay more, the EU is asking at least 15 billion €.
      All the best
      Klausbernd

      Liked by 1 person

    • Good morning, dear Pit,
      you ask the basic question “what would be the ideal political system?”
      Well, I personally don’t see democracy as ideal as most of the people are manipulated by the media and therefore I don’t want to be ruled by the people. And you see where leads to when in Germany far-right people demonstrate shouting “Wir sind das Volk”. Fortunately they are not ruling!
      But this is one side only, on the other hand I don’t know any better system than democracy.
      Politics without politician sounds great.
      All the best
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

    • We don’t have pure democracy. We have representative democracy. Thus the politicians rule by electoral rubber stamp. The problem is that we don’t all have time or desire to research every issue and fully understand all the implications before we decide. Most voters make up their minds without doing the work. That leads to bad decision-making. On the other hand, all political systems fail eventually, undermined by greed, incompetence and folly. So far “democracy” succeeds by pretending to be what it’s not. By and for the people.

      Like

    • Dear Brenda,
      I agree!
      Pure democracy as well as representative democracy only works if people are well educated instead of manipulated.
      I really like your sentence: “So far “democracy” succeeds by pretending to be what it’s not.”
      Platon suggests to let the philosophers rule – but where are these philosophers today?
      Have a happy weekend
      Klausbernd🙂

      Liked by 1 person

    • Philosophers have been ridiculed and left to poverty. We’ve become a society that must work for government or corporations to have status. Only the clergy still try to guide their flocks, and those flocks are dwindling. People turn to Hollywood for meaning, but that is more entertainment.

      In this country, I’ve met philosophers in public interest law, but those are the people excluded from rising to judgeships by the powers that be.

      You seem like a philosopher. Would you rule?

      Like

    • Dear Brenda
      thanks for the compliment! 🙂
      To become a ruler like a president or minister/secretary what a nightmare!
      I see it in our village only a certain type of people want to rule and these few people are the ones I don’t trust. But following my own believes I should be active in politics. I have been as a student and a short time afterwards, but now, oh dear, I just write a political comment here and there but that’s all. Well, we put up that sign for staying in the EU and we discuss politics with our neighbours, but all this takes place on a very small level.
      Thanks and cheers
      Klausbernd and the rest of the gang 🙂

      Liked by 1 person

  33. …..gerade liegen 10 wunderschöne Prinzessinnenkleidchen aus China, die für einen Tanz dringend benötigt werden, beim Zoll, amazon, DHL, ganz schön komplizierte Angelegenheit und viel viel Trouble um so ein paar Kleidchen….
    Unvorstellbar, dass es wieder alles so umständlich werden sollte in Europa…(von den anderen schlimmeren Umständen, die uns in Europa erwarten könnten ganz zu schwiegen)
    Bauen wir jetzt Mauern gegen etwas, gegen das es vollkommen sinnlos ist, Mauern zu bauen?
    Schreibt Pia, eine gute halbe Stunde von Ramstein entfernt und mit Blick auf die BASF, die auf Prinzessinnekleidchen in ziemlich grün wartet für den “Quarck-Quarck” Tanz…(haben leider keinen Frosch, Jungs trauen sich hier nicht so zum Ballett oder auch Eltern haben ihre Bedenken…leider)
    Ich werde mir so einen Maleranzug grün färben und dann als Frosch auftreten, so!
    Siri und Selma links und rechts neben mir, dann sehen wir gut aus! Ich sehe schon die Schlagzeilen..
    Schöne Woche euch!

    Like

    • Germaine Acogny from Africa visited me once…she performed in our theater. You can watch a piece of her show im Netz:
      Dakar, 9 juin 2011
      Wen ich auch sehr stark in ihrer Aussage fand: Anke Engelke (in ihrer unterhaltsamen Art…) nach dem Interview mit Assange: Ich würde gerne mal wissen, ob ich noch zu den Guten gehöre?!
      Liebdrücker von Pia

      Like

    • Ja, liebe Pia, Siri und Selma sind schon völlig aufgeregt.
      Ja, der Austausch mit Europa wird für die Briten echt kompliziert werden – oh dear!
      Auch dir eine schöne Woche
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

  34. Devastated that England and Wales voted to leave. But Scotland (and N Ireland) voted overwhelmingly to remain and is now in talks with the EU to see how that can be brought about. So you can always move north if we succeed.

    Liked by 2 people

    • We really think about it. We always loved Scotland.
      Well, now it’s the EU which doesn’t want the UK anymore but Scotland and N Ireland are welcome.
      All the best
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Like

  35. Zitat aus der “Zeit”: Ein überzeugender Gegenkandidat jedoch fehlt, wie der verzweifelt klingende Name der Kampagne verrät, die Johnson verhindern soll: Anyone But Boris.
    Erinnert mich an die verzweifelten Versuche der Republikaner hier, Donald Trump doch noch zu verhindern.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Lieber Pit
      Ja, ja, leider wird das UK immer mehr wie die US. Eine Schande ist das!
      Ich wollte, was ich dir eben mailte, hier reinsetzen, aber irgendwie wollte es nicht klappen und Dina ist auf Fototour (sie ist unsere Spezialistin für solche Probleme).
      Habe einen rundum schönen Tag 🙂
      Liebe Grüße
      Klausbernd und Siri & Selma

      Liked by 1 person

  36. I had to come back to make a comment, and that’s to say I could not believe the result the next morning. Shock was an understatement. Who knows how the outcome will affect us ex-pats across the channel. All I know is we’ll do everything we can to stay here. What a sad sad day it was for the UK.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Hi Klausbernd,
      I, too, still hope that there hasen’t been the last word on Brexit. But I’m afraid that with Theresa May now being the sole candidate for replacing David Cameron things don’t look good. To my mind, though, the necessary thing would be to hold a general election, especially considering that so many of the leading politicians on both sides have quit. That’s not absolutely necessary by Bristish law, but, under the present circumstances, should happen.
      Have a wonderful week,
      Pit

      Like

    • Hi dear Pit,
      Chris Taylor, a well known photographer from Sheringham, wrote this today:

      “Mayday Mayday Mayday.
      This is Britain, Britain, Britain. Mayday, this is Britain.
      Our position is 20 miles west of France.
      We have a serious political situation and require assistance to save our country from going under.
      We have 64 million people on board. Over.”

      Liked by 3 people

    • Hi dear Dina,
      That analogy to a ship is a good one, and has many aspects here. It’s not only that of the rats [i.e. the politicians in charge] leaving the sinking ship. With them it could also be that of a captain and his officers neglecting their duty and leaving the ship first. Or that of them either deliberately or negligently steering the ship on the rocks. So many, and none of them positive.
      And look who’s coming to the rescue now: Theresa May – a turncoat as far as her opinion about the Brexit is concerned – and that politclown Boris Johnson. Sorry about my wording. Normally I’m not that outspoken in a blog, but I’m still deeply upset. As to Theresa May: not only a turncoat as to the Brexit. She now is against calling a new general election, whereas she demanded one years ago when in 2007 Gordon Brown took over as PM from Tony Blair.
      Interesting times, isn’t it? But I really wish they were less interesting – in Europe and here in the US.
      Anyway, have a good time, all of you, in the small village near the big sea,
      Pit

      Like

  37. Dear Pit,
    new elections will not change the situation, I suppose. That’s because Labour is in a chaotic state and I am very sure the Conservatives would win. There isn’t an alternative as the Social Liberals are too weak and have no change in a majority voting system – what we think is quite undemocratic.
    We wish you a very happy week
    The Fab Four of Cley

    Liked by 1 person

    • Well, Klausbernd, you’ll never know about the outcome of elections. See “Brexit”. But I don’t believe there will be a new general election. As I said to Dina, Theresa May has ruled them out, and on the other hand it’s no longer so easy to call them.
      Have a good time anyway,
      Pit

      Liked by 1 person

    • Ja, lieber Pit
      Mit Boris Johnson als Außenminister wird nun der Brexit durchgeführt, was nichts Gutes verheißt. Aber wir lassen uns nicht unsere gute Laune nehmen.
      Ganz liebe Grüße dir aus dem sommerlichen Norfolk
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

    • Hallo Klausbernd,
      da hilft eben nur “stiff upper lip”. 😉
      Auch hier ist es sommerlich warm. D.h. eigentlich, mit “nur” 36 Grad, eher frühsommerlich. Noch sind die Temperaturen [in Fahrenheit] nicht dreistellig – jedenfalls nicht hier “oben” in Texas Hill Country. Kommt aber bestimmt noch.
      Habt’s auch fein, und genießt den Sommer an der Nordsee,
      Pit
      P.S. zu Boris Johnson: nach dem, was ich hier gelesen habe, ist das Außenmimnisterium, nachdem wichtige Bereiche auf andere Ministerien verlagert worden sind, wohl eher zu einem Abstellgleis geworden.

      Liked by 1 person

    • Dear Pit,
      als am Mittwoch bekannt wurde, dass Boris Johnson Außenminister geworden ist, dachten unsere englischen Nachbarn, die bei uns zu Besuch waren, das sei ein Witz. Sie wollten das einfach nicht glauben.
      Gratuliere zu deinem beeindruckenden Grill, den ich auf deinem Blog bewunderte – impressive!
      Liebe Grüße und feines Grillwetter wünschen dir
      The Fab Four of Cley

      Liked by 1 person

  38. Hallo Klausbernd,
    auch viele (europäische) Politiker haben diese Ernennung wohl zuerst für einen Witz gehalten. Ich bin mal gespannt, was Boris Johnson in seinem “kastrierten” Außenministerium so anstellt.Vielleicht wird es ja eine Filiale von Zirkus Krone. 😉
    Habt’s fein und lasst es Euch gut gehen,
    Pit

    Liked by 1 person

    • Lieber Pit,
      wir lieben deine Metapher von der Filiale von Zikus Krone und unsere lieben Buchfeen mussten so darüber kichern, dass sie fast aus ihren Schlummerbettchen gefallen wären.
      Auch dir eine wunderschön leichte Zeit
      The Fab Four of Cley
      die heute im Garten mulchen, worüber Siri und Selma maulen, da sie helfen sollen
      🙂🙂🙂🙂

      Like

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